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Tucker Carlson appearing on RT<\/span>RT screenshot<\/span><\/p>\n<\/div>\n A version of the below article\u00a0first appeared<\/a>\u00a0in David Corn\u2019s newsletter,\u00a0<\/em>Our Land.\u00a0The newsletter\u00a0comes out twice a week (most of the time) and provides behind-the-scenes stories and articles about politics, media, and culture. Subscribing costs just $5 a month\u2014but you can\u00a0sign up for a free 30-day trial<\/a>.<\/em><\/p>\n Among the politerati, <\/span>there\u2019s been much cogitating about what happens to Trumpism and MAGA once Donald Trump is gone. (The assumption is that, yes, one day he will not be here.) What might be next for this cultish movement without its godhead, especially given\u00a0the cleavages<\/a>\u00a0that have emerged over the Iran war, the Epstein files, Israel, and other matters? Can any of Trump\u2019s craven lieutenants win the support and devotion of Trump\u2019s following? JD Vance? Marco Rubio?<\/p>\n Some watchers of the right have speculated that Tucker Carlson might be the natural leader of post-Trump Trumpism. He has broken with Trump over the Iran war, but he remains perhaps the top influencer on the right, leading a rump group of conservatives (which includes former Rep. Marjorie Taylor Greene and soon-to-be-former Rep. Thomas Massie) who once were full MAGA and Trump loyalists but now are\u2026something else. Perhaps we could flatter them by calling this group America First conservatives, though that doesn\u2019t truly capture their nativism and extremism.<\/p>\n So it\u2019s important to pay attention to Carlson\u2019s peregrinations and associations. And he made a major move a few weeks ago,\u00a0appearing for an hour on RT<\/a>, the Russian state-controlled media outfit.<\/p>\n RT is more than just Vladimir Putin\u2019s propaganda mill. It runs disinformation operations, one of which was exposed two years ago when the Justice Department\u00a0indicted<\/a>\u00a0two RT employees for funneling at least $10 million to pro-Trump media figures in the United States, including Benny Johnson and Tim Pool. (Johnson, Pool, and the others claimed they didn\u2019t know the extravagant amounts they were paid originated in Moscow.) After that indictment was disclosed, Margarita Simonyan, the editor-in-chief of RT, went on Russian state television and boasted that RT worked \u201cundercover\u201d and engaged in \u201cpartisan warfare, guerrilla warfare,\u201d and she claimed it had created in America a network of \u201cbloggers with unbelievable audiences\u201d that had \u201can electorally significant influence.\u201d (For more on this RT operation, see my forthcoming book,\u00a0How Russia Won: Donald Trump, Vladimir Putin, and the Fight for America<\/em>.<\/a>)<\/p>\n \u201cI\u2019m a podcaster. I\u2019ve never run anything,\u201d Carlson told Rick Sanchez on RT. \u201cI\u2019m not planning to run for president, for sure.\u201d<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/figure>\n Carlson showed up on RT earlier this month as a guest on a show hosted by Rick Sanchez, a former CNN anchor who was fired in 2010 after making comments criticized as antisemitic. Subsequently, Sanchez put in a short stint at Fox News, and in 2019 he joined RT America, which shut down after Russia\u2019s full-scale invasion of Ukraine in 2022. Three years later, he moved to Moscow and became the anchor of RT International\u2019s flagship show.<\/p>\n At the start of their hourlong chat\u2014with the former Fox personalities noting they were close pals\u2014Sanchez reported that when he recently interviewed right-wing influencer (and nutball conspiracy theorist) Candace Owens during\u00a0a trip she made to Moscow<\/a>, she said she would back Carlson if he runs for president in 2028. Carlson responded with his trademark high-pitched chuckle and said, \u201cI\u2019m a podcaster. I\u2019ve never run anything\u2026I\u2019m not planning to run for president, for sure.\u201d<\/p>\n Once that matter was dispensed with, Carlson spent much of the broadcast sharing opinions that must have heartened the Kremlin. He claimed that the United States government is not controlled by elected officials but by a \u201cdeep state\u201d that is hell-bent on abolishing Russia. Democracy is an \u201cillusion\u201d in the United States, he insisted, and the \u201cEnglish-speaking West has been destroyed\u201d by enemies purposefully deploying \u201cmass migration\u201d as a weapon. Russia is next, he contended, because\u00a0they<\/em>\u00a0want a war with Russia. Carlson bleated:<\/p>\n Why do they hate Russia so much? Well, I think it\u2019s very much related to the fundamentals of Russia. Maybe being the last big white Christian country on the planet is a very dangerous thing to be. I don\u2019t want to believe these things\u2026But watching carefully for a long time has convinced me that the wacko fringe\u2019s darkest suspicions may have some truth in them. Because what\u2019s the other answer? Why would there be a war with Russia? Nobody wants this. But our leaders want this, and you have to ask why.<\/em><\/p>\n Carlson repeatedly asserted\u2014with Sanchez enthusiastically agreeing\u2014that the conflict in Ukraine is an American war against Russia, not a brutal invasion mounted by Putin. <\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/figure>\n As is often the case with demagogues, Carlson didn\u2019t specify who\u00a0they<\/em>\u00a0are. Who is orchestrating this war with Russia because it\u2019s a \u201cwhite Christian\u201d nation? Who knows?<\/p>\n Carlson repeatedly asserted\u2014with Sanchez enthusiastically agreeing\u2014that the conflict in Ukraine is an American war against Russia, not a brutal invasion mounted by Putin. \u201cThey think they have the right to control Russia,\u201d he said, maintaining that\u00a0they<\/em>\u00a0were deliberately provoking Russia in the hope that Putin would respond by attacking NATO with a hypersonic or nuclear weapon, that Russia could then be declared the aggressor, and that a third world war would be launched. That is,\u00a0they<\/em>\u00a0are engineering what could become a nuclear Armageddon.<\/p>\n This must be music to Putin\u2019s ears: Nefarious forces in control of the US government are pursuing a diabolical scheme to break up Russia, and that explains the war in Ukraine.<\/p>\n But who\u2019s behind this plan to start WWIII? Trump? Rubio? Pete Hegseth? Carlson never fingered any actual person. He kept referring to the \u201cderanged leadership class.\u201d He claimed the US government \u201chas been completely hijacked by people using the United States for their own interests.\u201d Again, who? Is it Vance? Carlson denounced both the Democratic and Republican parties as evil\u2014issuing the complaint there\u2019s little difference between the two\u2014and warned there\u2019s been \u201ca total takeover of the United States by people who hate the United States.\u201d Would that be Russell Vought? Or Mike Johnson?<\/p>\n Carlson\u2019s convoluted argument, is in sync with Moscow\u2019s talking points: The United States is responsible for the war in Ukraine, and Kyiv is an illegitimate government and no more than a pawn in an international conflict ignited by Washington. <\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/figure>\n Over and over, Carlson referred to the \u201cAmerican war against Russia,\u201d never once mentioning Putin\u2019s invasion of Ukraine or Russia\u2019s attacks on civilian targets, its alleged war crimes, and its kidnapping of thousands of Ukrainian children. Ukraine is \u201cnot a sovereign country fighting for its freedom,\u201d he argued, just a \u201cclient state of NATO and the United States\u201d that\u2019s being used to wipe out Russia.<\/p>\n Carlson was fuzzy on the motivation of these deep state cabalists who supposedly initiated this war on Russia and who are trying to spark a worldwide conflagration. At one point, he maintained their goal is to stop the East from rising and that the \u201conly way to reset [the current international status quo] is with a global war.\u201d His convoluted argument, though, is in complete sync with Moscow\u2019s talking points: The United States is responsible for the war in Ukraine, and Kyiv is an illegitimate government and no more than a pawn in an international conflict ignited by Washington. He praised Putin for practicing restraint in response to attacks on Russian soil\u2014which he attributed to the United States and the CIA, not Ukraine. Sanchez piped up that the Russians he golfs with are angry that Putin has not struck back more forcefully.<\/p>\n The interview was a lovefest for Putin and Russia. Sanchez praised Moscow for delivering healthcare, maternity leave, and overtime pay to the citizenry\u2014and for building more churches than are being constructed in the United States. He said that the people of Russia want Putin to stay in power. Carlson called Russia \u201ca beautiful country, an amazing country, my favorite country I\u2019ve ever visited.\u201d There was no talk of Putin\u2019s repressive ways or suppression of democracy.<\/p>\n They both offered critiques of America that overlap with those of the left: The political system is dominated by corporate interests, Carlson opined. Big Tech\u2014including Palantir, Apple, and Google\u2014controls the system. \u201cPower is in the hands of capital,\u201d Carlson declared, sounding like a DSA member. He also exclaimed that American politicians \u201care controlled by Israel,\u201d which he called a \u201ccriminal state\u201d for its assaults in Gaza that have killed thousands of civilians.<\/p>\n But don\u2019t look for Carlson to build a coalition with progressives. He assailed Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, saying she \u201cdoesn\u2019t like whites.\u201d That remark showed his anti-elite populism is propelled by his racialist views. The United States and the West are being de-whitened by an \u201cinvasion\u201d of dark-skinned migrants that\u2019s been cooked up by\u00a0them<\/em>, and Russia is now targeted for eradication because it\u2019s a white Christian nation. His conspiracism centers on race.<\/p>\n It\u2019s no surprise that Carlson is aping Putin\u2019s line on the war in Ukraine.<\/p>\n It\u2019s one thing to be used by Putin\u2019s propagandists; it\u2019s another to join forces with them.<\/p>\n<\/blockquote>\n<\/figure>\n In 2022, as Russian troops stormed into Ukraine, he echoed Russian disinformation that falsely claimed the United States operated bioweapons labs in Ukraine. (That was one reason that Moscow gave for its \u201cspecial military operation.\u201d) At that time, I\u00a0revealed<\/a>\u00a0the Kremlin had instructed state-friendly media outlets to include clips and quotes of Carlson in their articles and broadcasts. \u201cIt is essential to use as much as possible fragments of broadcasts of the popular Fox News host Tucker Carlson, who sharply criticizes the actions of the United States [and] NATO, their negative role in unleashing the conflict in Ukraine, [and] the defiantly provocative behavior from the leadership of the Western countries and NATO towards the Russian Federation and towards President Putin, personally,\u201d a Kremlin document said. It summed up Carlson\u2019s position: \u201cRussia is only protecting its interests and security.\u201d<\/p>\n It\u2019s one thing to be used by Putin\u2019s propagandists; it\u2019s another to join forces with them. Carlson told Sanchez his policy is to \u201cspeak to anyone who will have me,\u201d including Israeli television or North Korean television. Yet by appearing on RT, he\u2019s collaborating with an organization that\u2019s part of Putin\u2019s intelligence and disinformation network that supports this horrific war in Ukraine and that targets the United States. He also demonstrated that the conspiracism of the America First right overlaps with the disinformation pushed by Putin and his operatives.<\/p>\n\n
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